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User talk:GW-Stabber/archive 2
Welcome back Welcome back ^^ 00:38, 7 April 2006 (CDT) You silly girl, you completely blew that dramatic exit! How on earth are you going to top that the next time you decide to go all suicidey on us? PS: I can quit any time. Just watch me walk away from the wiki. Yup. Walking away as we wpeak, yes ma'am. I can so quit this, I'm confident. I have confidence in sunshine! I have confindence in rain! I have confidence that spring will come again! Besides which, you see, I have confidence in me! esan 00:42, 7 April 2006 (CDT) :I see you have skipped Denial, Anger, Bargaining, Depression and Acceptance, and gone straight to stage 6: Showtunes. — Stabber 00:45, 7 April 2006 (CDT) ::Welcome back.. :) --Karlos 01:03, 7 April 2006 (CDT) :::Now the wiki feels like home again. --[[User:Gem|'Gem']] 07:48, 7 April 2006 (CDT) I like your bird Wow, Dumpling is pretty. Awesome pets really inspire me to care about my ranger again. Err, does all the gothful spikiness come preinstalled? --130.58 21:39, 9 April 2006 (CDT) :You mean the leg irons? Yeah, the bird came with them. Clearly the fauna in the Kurzick territories have evolved Gothic accessories to fit in in their hypergothic surroundings. — Stabber (talk) 21:42, 9 April 2006 (CDT) ::*Snerk*. I just love animal companions that pretty much require you to blow 30k on black body armor to go with them. Here's hoping PVP rangers will get a different pet if they pick Cantha as their region of origin... Was this thing wandering around by itself? --130.58 22:20, 9 April 2006 (CDT) :::I don't want to spoil it for you if you haven't encountered it already, but one of the Kurzick quests takes you to a region that has these bird(s). — Stabber (talk) 22:22, 9 April 2006 (CDT) ::::Wait till the farming society starts ruining it (as they ruin everything else) and start making "Black Moa Runs" for 10k. :( I cringe at the thought. --Karlos 18:37, 11 April 2006 (CDT) About "Tools for the Guildwiki Metagame" Category Deletions The first 3 categories that I looked at (first 3 categories alphabetically, 2 axe ones and one bow one) seem to still have skills categorized in them. I checked the new category and I didn't see these skills in them. Could you check and make sure that Stabbot is working correctly? --Rainith 16:34, 10 April 2006 (CDT) :It is currently running. At the rate of one edit every half minute, it will take about 5 hours for it to finish all the skills. It's probably best if you can hold off on the deletions until I post the "end" time at the bottom of User:Stabbot#Log. — Stabber (talk) 16:35, 10 April 2006 (CDT) :Oh, and it's going by campaign rather than by profession, so you'll still see the prophecies and factions skills in the categories. It's about 80% finished with the core skills. — Stabber (talk) 16:37, 10 April 2006 (CDT) ::Ah, ok, maybe better to hold off on marking the categories for deletion until it is done then. :) --Rainith 16:39, 10 April 2006 (CDT) :::I can stop now if you want me to, but then I won't be able to get back to it until very late in the night. — Stabber (talk) 16:41, 10 April 2006 (CDT) Response to AA Comment I'm aware about anti-aliasing, I would have preferred that it was on when I took the pictures. However, I took them just as Guild Wars was upgrading to DirectX 9, and there was a problem where I was unable to take screenshots while Anti-Aliasing was on. I may redo them at some point (perhaps when I do the Chapter 2 items to keep things uniform), but doing it all even once was a lot of work, and it didn't bother me enough to redo them right away. They are my own images, I took them as part of redoing our guild's (Tyrian Explorers League) weapon and armor gallery. I'm also hoping to get a gallery started on either GWO or GWG eventually. --Scutilla 18:19, 10 April 2006 (EST) Barrage presearing That was not me btw.. *throttles brother* I leave it logged on on all PCs/accounts Skuld 12:23, 11 April 2006 (CDT) Differences between regions Not exactuly sure if you are interested, but since you found certain info surprising, I figure I'll point you to where others are documented: Account#Differences between each Guildwars Localization: -PanSola 20:30, 11 April 2006 (CDT) :Ah, thanks. Hadn't seen that page before. — Stabber (talk) 01:50, 12 April 2006 (CDT) Jpg Images I'm out of the loop. Is the wiki switching to using the FSK jpg images for all skills now? If so would it be fine if I started putting redirects in the Image pages so they go to the skill once clicked on? | Chuiu 23:43, 11 April 2006 (CDT) :Yes to the first question (see, eg., Project talk:Style and formatting/Skills/Archive 6 for the vote on this issue), and my bot is about to do the skill icon redirects soon. Don't bother doing them by hand unless you want to invite Carpal Tunnel Syndrome. — Stabber (talk) 23:46, 11 April 2006 (CDT) ::By the way, this is now done. — Stabber (talk) 01:49, 12 April 2006 (CDT) :::Niiice. The patchwork variation of the old image set was really starting to get on my nerves. I noticed a few minor issues: Enfeebling Blood has the wrong icon. I think a few skills, like Inferno, might be missing borders, too. Much, much better than the icons we had before, though! --130.58 01:54, 12 April 2006 (CDT) ::::Make a note of the ones missing borders somewhere, as you notice them. They are missing borders in the FSK also. I noticed a few myself, but unfortunately failed to note them down. You can use User:Stabber/skill icons as the master list of all skills if you want to be exhaustive about it. — Stabber (talk) 01:56, 12 April 2006 (CDT) :::::I don't think missing borders are important, unless they are elite skills. We only care about gold borders. -PanSola 01:57, 12 April 2006 (CDT) ::::::I would like to add the borders to all images missing them. Do I need to shrink the images so that the current image is completely in the middle of the borders, or should I just put the borders over the image? (I hope its the second one) --[[User:Gem|'Gem']] 11:33, 12 April 2006 (CDT) :::::::I am not fully sure. Rainith seems like the one to ask. From a cursory look, it seems that all FSK images, borderful or not, are 64×64, so I assume that if the border is x'' pixels wide, then you have to scale the image itself down to (64 - 2''x)×(64 - 2''x''), and then add the border. But I could be wrong. — Stabber (talk) 12:05, 12 April 2006 (CDT) I did some comparisons and it seems like we would need to resize then add the border. These are resize then add border | added border. As you can see some things get cut off. I then went back and took a look at all the other skill icons in comparison to their old FSK counterparts and it seems ANET resized then added the border aswell. | Chuiu 12:33, 12 April 2006 (CDT) :I also just made some comparisons and it seems that resizing is needed. I will start my work now, but i will not upload the images yet as PanSola seems to have something against them. --[[User:Gem|'Gem']] 12:36, 12 April 2006 (CDT) Don't do the resizing by hand! This border adding can be automated pretty easily using ImageMagick. The incantation is: % convert Borderless_Image.jpg -resize 56x56 Borderless_Image_resized.jpg % composite -compose atop -geometry +4+4 Borderless_Image_resized.jpg Optional.jpg Borderful_Image.jpg If you give me a list of skill icons that need this borders, I can conjure up a script easily enough. — Stabber (talk) 12:42, 12 April 2006 (CDT) :Some of them may still need to be done by hand. I have found many of the non-border ones actually DO have a border of 1px. So while the ones with no border can be done in that method, I don't think the ones that already have the 1px border can. Compiling the list now ... | Chuiu 12:53, 12 April 2006 (CDT) ::Ah complications! In that case, make two lists -- one that lists the pristine images, and the other that lists the 1-bordered images. The tweak for a script going from one case to the other is pretty minimal. — Stabber (talk) 12:55, 12 April 2006 (CDT) :::Arg! Some have a border of 2px also! Anet is so inconsistant! The world is ending! Overexaggeration! Working on all 3 lists (possibly 4, I bet there are some 3px somewhere...) | Chuiu 12:56, 12 April 2006 (CDT) ::::Oh my. The list I compiled is here: Bull's Charge had an old version of the elite border. Mending has a border which is too small. The missing or 1px borders are in: Arcane Conundrum, Blinding Flash, Conjure Lightning, Energy Burn, Enfeeble, Epidemic, Fireball, Fire Storm, Flare, Gale, Heal Area, Heal Other, Holy Wrath, Ignorance, Imagined Burden, Inferno, "I Will Avenge You!", Kindle Arrows, Lava Font, Life Attunement, Lightning Orb, Live Vicariously, Plague Touch, Power Leak, Power Spike, Protective Spirit, Rend Enchantments, Resurrect, Retribution, Soul Barbs. ::::These are clear ones, but if there are ones with borders that are a pixel or two smaller... --[[User:Gem|'Gem']] 13:01, 12 April 2006 (CDT) Well I just finished my list. It's a bit more complete also... 0 , , , 1 , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , 2 , , | Chuiu 13:16, 12 April 2006 (CDT) ::Nice work. I missed the Sever Artery and didn't have the exact border widths. --[[User:Gem|'Gem']] 13:36, 12 April 2006 (CDT) :::Thanks. I have the images converted, but MediaWiki is giving me a lot of timeouts when uploading them. Will try in ten minutes or so when the server isn't so overloaded. — Stabber (talk) 13:40, 12 April 2006 (CDT) :::Done! — Stabber (talk) 14:10, 12 April 2006 (CDT) ::::Sorry to spoil this, but we all forgot one skill. Resurrection Signet --[[User:Gem|'Gem']] 14:17, 12 April 2006 (CDT) :::::Is there a FSK version of this? I couldn't find it. I just slapped on a border on the screencap image that was already there, but it looks decidedly strange with the border. — Stabber (talk) 14:21, 12 April 2006 (CDT) ::::::I think there isn't. Maby someone could e-mail Anet about this if he/she is interested. I ain't as long as we have a bordered version which doesn't look too awfull. --[[User:Gem|'Gem']] 14:25, 12 April 2006 (CDT) :::::::The FSKs are missing the images for Resurrection Signet, Signet of Capture and Bull's Charge. --Rainith 16:08, 12 April 2006 (CDT)\ ::::::::That would be why I missed SOC and Res sig. I checked through the skill images I have on my computer. | Chuiu 16:16, 12 April 2006 (CDT) ---- What about factions skills? The skill bar template got changed to jpg and there are a lot of red links to assasain images Skuld 16:13, 12 April 2006 (CDT) :Aww, the poor widdle assassins. (I didn't change the template -- you should negotiate with PanSola if you want the skill bar template to be png for a while longer. The pngs aren't deleted yet.) — Stabber (talk) 16:18, 12 April 2006 (CDT) Augury Rock to Thirsty River discussion I moved our discussion off Skuld's talk page and onto mine (your names really don't look that alike, I mean they both start with an S but that's about it, I'm not sure how I confused them :P ). I'm sorry we're getting into an argument on this, I got cut up the other day about being critisied on two artices that were a sentence long. It's never nice to hear someone tear down something you've worked hard on (such as that article). Anyway the discussion is now on my Talk Page so we can continue it there. --Xasxas256 04:40, 12 April 2006 (CDT) :Well, I think we're at an agreeable impasse, so it's best to leave things be. I am intentionally not reading your response on your talk page because I don't trust my judgment in these matters, and I am sure to respond in a way that I'll regret later. I'll be off worrying about other areas of the wiki for now. — Stabber (talk) 04:43, 12 April 2006 (CDT) ::You sound like me 5 nights ago, well I probably handled it with less grace, but the whole getting into an argument and not wanting to post I say something I regret later. Actually probably anyone who regularly edits wikis gets like this occasionally. I hate to be the one on the other side this time causing the grief, sorry to put you in a bad mood, but I'm glad we seem to be back on speaking terms again (were we on speaking terms before? maybe we've now opened a dialog, so it's an improvement! :) Should I wipe the whole thing off my user page now? I know I wouldn't be able to resist looking, particularly as my name is about to follow and it's only 2 clicks away... --Xasxas256 05:14, 12 April 2006 (CDT) :::Heh. Don't bother blanking it. Nothing is really erasable once it's in the wiki anyhow. Now go see about those shrimps on the barbie before a kangaroo comes by and nicks them. — Stabber (talk) 05:21, 12 April 2006 (CDT) ::::Blimey! Kangaroos are herbivores? Shows what I know. — Stabber (talk) 05:23, 12 April 2006 (CDT) :::::That's why they taste so good, Australia is the only country in the world where they eat their national emblam. I've had roo before, it's actually not too bad but you don't really see it for sale in the supermarket much, I mean you see them wandering down the main road in Sydney of course though ;) Roos can get aggressive around mating season tho and they have been known to attack people now and then, a big male can do a lot of damage to a kid, but no they don't eat them :) --Xasxas256 05:34, 12 April 2006 (CDT) Sorry about putting the del notice for 84.25.40.110 on the wrong spot, I don't have to deal with repeated vandalism very often, anyway in some ways it was kinda nice to work along side you against some common evil for a few minutes. Hmmm I'll go back to reading 1984 instead of thinking that it applies to real life... --Xasxas256 09:20, 18 April 2006 (CDT) color coded Babel boxes At least the wikipedia babel boxes are supposed to be color coded by leve. I can only find the documentation on the chinese page (but it shouldn't be too hard to understand), at the bottom of http://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/WP:BBL. Not to say you have to use them, but just providing them if you happen to be interested in conforming. -PanSola 20:03, 12 April 2006 (CDT) :I am aware of that color code. I specifically made mine not conform for fairly obvious reasons. — Stabber (talk) 20:08, 12 April 2006 (CDT) ::The reasons are't immediately obviouse to me. Though after some moments of pondering, I come up with two possible reasons: 1. You philosophically/principally/ideologically disagree with the Babel system or color scheme used by wikipedia, so decided to make up your own; 2. you aren't actually marking languages you have knowledge of, it's all a parody. -PanSola 23:04, 12 April 2006 (CDT) :::A parody?! You deeply wound me, sir. I assure you, I'm a near native speaker of Tree! — Stabber (talk) 23:07, 12 April 2006 (CDT) ::::Whew, for a while there I was worried that I was the only one facing such scrutiny from PanSola over things that do not seem to warrant such scrutiny. I am glad it's not something directed at me, but a part of the greater world domination plan. Carry on, folks. --Karlos 04:13, 13 April 2006 (CDT) :::::How do you know the world domination plan isn't directed at you? -PanSola 10:38, 13 April 2006 (CDT) Noob question Hey how did you change your wiki font? I canna get it to work. Also answer your email you noob. esan 21:16, 12 April 2006 (CDT) :How did I change my what? You mean like User:Stabber/monobook.css? BTW I just responded to your stupid email. :P — Stabber (talk) 21:29, 12 April 2006 (CDT) ::Milady, if it weren't biologically impossible, I'd say you were the most cocksure person I've ever met. esan 21:38, 12 April 2006 (CDT) :::Shinu tsumori ka omae? Iikagen ni shinai to na. — Stabber (talk) 21:43, 12 April 2006 (CDT) attack skill categories Took me a while to remember to double check it. But just like Enchantment Spells, we got Melee Attacks, Axe Attacks etc. So please move them back as well. -PanSola 10:40, 13 April 2006 (CDT) :I'm making a list of the ones I need to move back. Can you make sure that it's complete (just add the missing ones)? — Stabber (talk) 12:31, 13 April 2006 (CDT) ::I'm not sure whether the "H" in Off-hand Attacks is upper or lower. Will take a better look on saturday.-PanSola 12:48, 13 April 2006 (CDT) :::It was a capital in the FPE (got a screenshot if you want). — Stabber (talk) 12:51, 13 April 2006 (CDT) mistakenly moved skillcats *Category:Axe Attacks *Category:Bow Attacks *Category:Dagger Attacks *Category:Dual Attacks *Category:Enchantment Spells *Category:Hammer Attacks *Category:Hex Spells *Category:Lead Attacks *Category:Monster Skills *Category:Off-Hand Attacks *Category:Pet Attacks *Category:Sword Attacks *Category:Weapon Spells :Hmm, we'll need to add back in two of these it looks like. Also as I was deleting these today I came across two with the delete tag that still had skills (and in one case sub-categories) in them: :*Category:Enchantment spells :*Category:Melee Attacks :I don't want to cause more problems, so I'm not going to assume that these should stay or go without hearing from you. :) --Rainith 21:33, 18 April 2006 (CDT) ::Category:Melee Attacks definitely is the correct capitalization as it appears as such in the desc of, eg., Wild Blow. Category:Dagger Attacks is not quite as certain, as I don't believe there are any dagger attacks that are not lead, off-hand, or dual attacks. As for the Category:Enchantment spells -- Stabbot was cleaning it up right as GuildWiki went on its extended lockout and downtime, and then Stabbot lost his train of thought. Will clean it up manually now. — Stabber (talk) 21:37, 18 April 2006 (CDT) :::Thanks, I figured that was how each category would work out, but again, I didn't want to assume anything (that got me in trouble at work recently). ;) --Rainith 21:40, 18 April 2006 (CDT) ::::Should hopefully be fixed now. Sorry about the mess up. — Stabber (talk) 21:42, 18 April 2006 (CDT) Henchman Redundancies I have no complaints with removing the redundancies, other than those that may have a table of contents will have the TOC start below any text that lacks a header. However, for consistency, the Prophecies henchman have the same header designations, and whichever is used (keep header or remove) should likely be done for them as well as for the new Factions henchmen. --161.88.255.140 10:41, 21 April 2006 (CDT) :Henchmen articles should be NOTOC, in my opinion. Will remove the prophecies henchmen designations also. — Stabber 10:46, 21 April 2006 (CDT) ::Do not remove Prophecies henchmen section vs NPC section for the ones that are found as NPCs and quest givers as well as henchment (i.e. the Fab Four). --Karlos 03:59, 22 April 2006 (CDT) :::Not planning to. I haven't yet finalized my plans for torturing those articles, but rest assured that I will not leave them more confusing than they are now. — Stabber 04:01, 22 April 2006 (CDT) HOLD all manual edits I can understanding holding edits on the main articles. But did you meant to ask us to also hold all edits on Talk:GuildWars.com news itself? Literal interpretation says yes, but my intuition says no, so jsut want to doublecheck. -PanSola 18:08, 21 April 2006 (CDT) :No, talk pages are fine. I mainly just need the "GuidWars.com news/daynumber" pages untouched. — Stabber 18:16, 21 April 2006 (CDT) Optional Slots Yes, the filling of the Optional slots was necessary. I've played a bonding monk for ages, and fully supporting multiple bonds on 8 different people is near-impossible without Essence Bond, which greatly increases your MP flow. Also, Balthazar's Spirit does not grant you energy, but instead grants the person it was casted on, Energy, so I am not sure why it is there. Lastly, Life Attunement allows for a huge jump in the healing abilities of other monks, and for anyone who wishes to become a good Bonder, it is not just necessary, it is mandatory. 64.229.92.248 20:43, 21 April 2006 (CDT) :Don't tell me, write it in the article. My objection is mainly about leaving it inconsistent. — Stabber 20:57, 21 April 2006 (CDT) :By the way, if you leave the article inconsistent for a long period of time (like, say, a day), I will revert it. — Stabber 21:05, 21 April 2006 (CDT) ::Was a threat implied in that statement? --64.229.92.248 21:20, 21 April 2006 (CDT) :::Very much yes. Get cracking! — Stabber 21:21, 21 April 2006 (CDT) ::::Yes, m'lord! :P --64.229.92.248 21:22, 21 April 2006 (CDT) 'Uses campaigns skills' -template You removed the template from the trapper team build. I understood that this should be used if the build only requires skills from one campaign. There is the large optional Factions skills table, but none of those skills are required and none of them are used in the main build. Prophecies however is a must as you can't access UW without it and you need a lot of Prophecies skills. I wanted to emphasize that this is mainly a Prophecies build, which might be improved with other campaigns' skills. If the template shouldn't be used here, I don't see any point in having the template in the first place. --[[User:Gem|'Gem']] 04:24, 22 April 2006 (CDT) :You may be interested in the discussion on Project talk:Style and formatting/Builds. The prevailing opinion was that these templates are designed to be nice to people who don't buy multiple campaigns. They should not read a build article and get the subliminal message that things would be a lot better if they bought other campaigns also and linked their accounts. Maybe you disagree with this opinion (I certainly do), but it requires some more discussion. The template as it stands states something on the order of "do not link stuff from other campaigns", which is incongruous with stuff from other campaigns, obviously. — Stabber 04:27, 22 April 2006 (CDT) ::Again an important discussion which I have forgotten after reading the initial comments. Now I understand the small comment at the bottom of the box and I will accept the current use of the template. However, I would like to put the template in use like explained in my initial comment. --[[User:Gem|'Gem']] 04:42, 22 April 2006 (CDT) eum.. Sorry I didn't know :) but where do I make them "legal" to post? cuz to the left something (I aint that smart ^^) plz help so I can add ingame pictures =) :Look on the left of the window in the "toolbox". You'll see a link that says (or its translation in your language). Once you upload the file, you can link to it as , assuming the name of your image is "File Name.jpg". — Stabber 11:19, 22 April 2006 (CDT) Attribute template Nice work on that template! Skuld 14:42, 23 April 2006 (CDT) :Thanks. — Stabber (✍ • 2006-04-23 19:43 UTC) Dunes of Despair I can see your point in removing the note below the exploit, but if people think that the exploit doesn't work we should have a note explaining that it works now, althouogh it previously didn't. --[[User:Gem|'Gem']] 07:31, 24 April 2006 (CDT) :The thing it mentioned about mobs running away is a pathing bug that has existed from the very beginning of the game. You'll notice that only melee mobs run away -- you can still kill ranged and caster mobs from the ledge. The person who thought that this was a fixed exploit wasn't aware of this "feature". — Stabber ✍ 07:35, 24 April 2006 (CDT) :To be more clear -- this bug is triggered whenever you attack a melee mob who can't reach you. Another place where you'll see this is the ledge above the bridge to the Forgotten Vale in the Underworld. There are two Bladed Aatxes in longbow range, but the moment you fire an arrow at one they run all the way back to the cavern in the Labyrinth. — Stabber ✍ 07:40, 24 April 2006 (CDT) ::I think we should include some kind of mention below the exploit. Would you like to do it so that it pleases everyone? --[[User:Gem|'Gem']] 07:41, 24 April 2006 (CDT) Fame can be so fleeting at times For a moment there, I had made it to the big-time! I was on an exclusive list! But now its gone, and my dedicated efforts and hardwork towards achieve the elite status of having a "user page of people who have better things to do than create elaborate user pages" is no longer recognized. Oh well, it was fun while it lasted! --161.88.255.140 11:47, 25 April 2006 (CDT) :Really, it is an honor just to be nominated. :P --Rainith 11:51, 25 April 2006 (CDT) ::Sorry, didn't realize it was such a popular feature. — Stabber ✍ 11:54, 25 April 2006 (CDT) :::Thanks for bringing it back - I feel so honored! I would like to thank all the people who helped me achieve this ... --161.88.255.140 12:05, 25 April 2006 (CDT) ::::The list is great. I have no chance to get there as I like having a cool user page and use a lot of time to perfect it, but these people really deserve the mention. By the way: Is this a parody of my list of cool user pages, a parody of something else, or just random coolnes? ;) --[[User:Gem|'Gem']] 12:09, 25 April 2006 (CDT) :::::It's a parody of something... not sure what. Aren't user pages themselves parodies of the people who make them? — Stabber ✍ 12:17, 25 April 2006 (CDT) ::::::Like the twinkling of stars in the twilight hours, and the quick rush of water down a riverbed; no. Seek the envy within. Sleep depravation = yum? Evan The Cursed (Talk) 22:00, 26 April 2006 (CDT) ::::::: Ha ha yeah when I saw your list Gem I was a little disappointed that I wasn't on it, I mean Nilles regonises that my awesome user page is like an early 80s Porsche 911 (it's ok you're on his list too as having a cool page :P ). But personally I prefer being on Stabber's list, I'm with some elite company there, including our lord and master himself (Gravewit). I have added the stress level thing onto mine but it's ok, I think my page is still unique and has utility only, it still looks like I’ve spent no time on making it "pretty"! The wikistress pic just means that next time I have a fight with you Stabber, you can see that I'm not just angry with you, I'm angry with the whole world! --Xasxas256 01:08, 27 April 2006 (CDT) ::::::::Sorry for not having you in my list. The purpose was to list pages with nice looks which I could copy ruthlessly. Now that I really don't need the list for that purpose I could add generally helpful pages too, like yours. NEed to think about it. --[[User:Gem|'Gem']] 11:39, 27 April 2006 (CDT) :::::::::No need to apologise, I wasn't really having a go at you for not having me on your list Gem, I mean look at the user pages on it, mine would be totally out of place there, it would be an injustice for both of us! Maybe some day I'll crack and create a nice looking user page with pretty colors, boxes with rounded corners, pics and all the rest...but until then my user page will continue to look like some anti-Gem response (although in actual fact it's older than yours), hooray for substance over style (well yours has more of both but I'll continue to keep deluding myself! :P) -- Xasxas256 18:21, 27 April 2006 (CDT) ::::::::::I understood you completely before. :) But I am seriously considering having a new category for informative and good (not good looking) user pages. --[[User:Gem|'Gem']] 19:46, 27 April 2006 (CDT) Lonely categories Category:Envoys is blank, and has one entry. what do you plan to do with this category? i removed it because categories with one entry are functionally useless. additionally, Wiktionary defines an envoy as a diplomat or representative; skills that a 200 years dead traitor would be hardly capable of performing. :There will be more Envoys added once I replay that first mission with my other characters and remember to take screenshots. Shiro will not be the only member of that category for long. Envoys feature prominently in the main storyline in Factions. — Stabber ✍ 15:42, 28 April 2006 (CDT) Hi Ok Stabber i will but i just tried something sorry, have fun, i'm going to bed now, it too late here :p The time has matured I think there is a sufficient mixure of consensus, apathy, ignorance, and best-effort-to-remove-apathy-and-ignorance, for us to go ahead and let Stabbot change the skill box templates in all the skill articles. We can rightously disclaim any responsibility if anyone is surprised or shocked at the change. -PanSola 04:55, 1 May 2006 (CDT) :All right. I'll be a bit busy with various things for a couple of days, so expect the run to happen by around Wed/Thu. — Stabber ✍ 08:05, 1 May 2006 (CDT) ::FYI, I've moved the portrait6 to Template:Skill box and landscape v5 to Template:Skill quick reference. Otherwise the syntax is listed in User:PanSola/Hybrid 6 List and Syntax. -PanSola 05:00, 3 May 2006 (CDT) :::OK. The templates need some minor tweaks, mainly to remove references to your user page. I've taken a first shot at it, and produced Unyielding Aura by hand-running my code. If that is acceptable, then I will tailor my robot to do exactly what I did by hand. — Stabber ✍ 06:32, 3 May 2006 (CDT) ::::Looks good, try Rush too. (-: -PanSola 06:38, 3 May 2006 (CDT) :::::OK, just did Rush also by hand. Check out Project:Sandbox for the inclusions. I have a fair idea of what needs to be done now. — Stabber ✍ 07:14, 3 May 2006 (CDT) BTW, is it better or worse (server load wise) to use a tempalte call or a Eq? The "test" tempate won't behave properly if someone set "elite=no" -PanSola 06:40, 3 May 2006 (CDT) :I'm just testing something for a bit. I will probably revert to your elite? design. — Stabber ✍ 06:42, 3 May 2006 (CDT) :Also, to address your question about server load, I dug through how MediaWiki does templates, and it turns out that it doesn't matter as the templates will only be computed once and then cached until the page is re-edited. So my worries about excessive server load were actually unfounded. So I think eq? should be fine. — Stabber ✍ 06:46, 3 May 2006 (CDT) I have to shelf this project for the rest of the day as I am needed at work. Will get back to it in the evening after work. — Stabber ✍ 07:53, 3 May 2006 (CDT) :Take your time (-: -PanSola 08:28, 3 May 2006 (CDT) Tengu Mask: Concerning Vandalism Honestly, I don't know what happened to the Tengu Mask article. I made a minor edit and reviewed it. It looked exactly like I wanted it to. I then saved it and must have saved right after whomever added the armor formatting to it. Because my minor edit saved right over top of theirs. Which is horrible because when I began editting the article, it had no formatting whatsoever. I apologize fully to whomever's work I ended up removing. ... You just made my day. Thanks for cheering me up! --[[User:Gem|'Gem']] 15:09, 2 May 2006 (CDT) RC prot monk I overrode your edit in the copyediting conflict Stabber, please have a second look if you feel anything is missing from my version. --Xeeron 13:18, 5 May 2006 (CDT) :Aieee. OK, sorry for stepping on your toes. I marginally prefer my version because it snipped a bunch of chatter and left just the juicy bits, but chatter is cool too. — Stabber ✍ 13:27, 5 May 2006 (CDT) 1.5k Kurz Thanks, ill take care of it right away! Sorry for the misshaps. Appreciate the corrections :) I dont have the femal 1.5k armor icons, so I cant fix that now, I just took the screen shot from someone with their permission. I will keep my eyes open though, and try to fix it asap if it doesnt get taken care by someone else first --Tor Den Mektige :All right. Don't worry too much about it. And thanks for fixing the male version. Looks much better now. — Stabber ✍ 14:13, 5 May 2006 (CDT) Not a problem :) Not to used to wiki's yet, but ill get there :D --Tor Den Mektige Skill hunter Nice idea and pretty fun actually. I'll use this build some time with a new character who has no skills. You are the master of fun things! Replace a few '''Resurrection Signets' with other skills'' should probably read Replace a few '''Signets of Capture' with other skills''. You should also note that non-elite skills can also be captured, so you can pack 7 or 8 SoCs with you and get a full skillbar. --[[User:Gem|'Gem']] 18:24, 6 May 2006 (CDT) Wow. I never knew that this wiki was full of imputent editors such as yourself, especially the fact that you're not an admin, and acting superior to everyone else. Plus, I want to edit out wrong info, and now I'm being prevented from doing so by you. --64.229.196.153 19:57, 6 May 2006 (CDT) :Yes, welcome to GuildWIki. We are all stuck up pricks here. Have a nice day. — Stabber ✍ 19:58, 6 May 2006 (CDT) ::That's taking it too literal. Plus, acting like an admin and not being one, and threatening with bans? Seriously... That's just becoming quite ignorant and pathetic.--64.229.196.153 20:00, 6 May 2006 (CDT) :Stabber you are just about equally guilty in the revert war considering you also did not discuss on the talk page why you are reverting the reverts of the anon user -PanSola 20:10, 6 May 2006 (CDT) Explanation for ban notice Stabber is guilty of breaking Project:Only revert once. No one has come to her defense. This is not the first time Stabber has behaved in an unjustified abusive manner. See the history of Talk:List of skill anomalies for another famous flameout. Whatever the contributions of this user, her temper is not an asset to GuildWiki. All wikis go through a phase where long time members start behaving erratically and end up causing more harm than good. At such times, it is usually necessary to codify policies about how to deal with them. This is GuildWiki's turn. I am forcing this issue somewhat. F G 04:52, 7 May 2006 (CDT) :It was just a simple disagreement... If anything, I think he's right. Balthazar's spirit is much more effective than essence bond for bonding. If you put it on yourself, you only have to maintain one enchantment and gain the same amount of energy as you would placing essence bond on every single party member. What I do not agree with, however, was the method by which he tried to enforce his opinions. I don't believe he deserves a ban. Just my .002. --Krin 04:57, 7 May 2006 (CDT) ::To be perfectly clear, Stabber has not expressed an opinion for or against the substance of the disagreement. This has all the appearance of a policy dispute, and should be addressed as policy. To wit: should normal users feel empowered to patrol and enforce Project:Only revert once? My personal opinion is that they should not. This is one of the few privileges that should be the sole domain of sysops and bureaucrats. F G 05:01, 7 May 2006 (CDT) :::I am generally against banning well known contributors. It really doesn't accomplish anything, as he person in question is not likely to do anything against the wiki policies during the ban period anyway, but he/she would be prevented from contributing useful stuff. Stabber seems to have taken a small break from wiki without a ban, so that further makes this ban unnecessary. Concerning the ban policy, I don't think that a revertwar of only a few reverts on a BUILD page is really deserving a ban. I say no for the ban. --[[User:Gem|'Gem']] 05:15, 7 May 2006 (CDT) :::Ps. I really think the wiki contributors act as little childs too often. We should ALL (me too) try to behave as adults, even if we aren't. --[[User:Gem|'Gem']] 05:15, 7 May 2006 (CDT) ::::I dont think a one time breaking of the only revert once rule warrants a ban. --Xeeron 05:20, 7 May 2006 (CDT) :The only reason I did not come to Stabbers defense yesterday was because I did not feel it was even nessecary. Stabber may indeed have a temper, but what you are proposing is uncalled for in the extreme. She is a good contributor, an important comunity figure, and well respected for knowledge and wit on the wiki. And as for this revert-war, I flat out disagree with your assesment that Stabber somehow started it. In fact, the first thing she did was to explain her actions on the user page of the anonymous user is question and ask that he abide the revert rules. : In summary, she may have gotten carried away slightly, but she was in the right, factually and policy-wise, and the ban-proposal is uncalled for and should be removed. --Bishop (rap| ) 05:23, 7 May 2006 (CDT) ::Now after reading most of the talk pages conserning this matter, I see Stabber really asked the anon to explain the edits (on talk pages and in edit notes). Wven if she broke the revert only once thingie, she did nothing wrong. --[[User:Gem|'Gem']] 05:26, 7 May 2006 (CDT) Digging through Stabber's contributions, I've noticed at least a few other incidents that should have raised red flags. *Talk:Shiro Tagachi (another revert war) *User talk:Tor Den Mektige (scaring a new user with sternly worded statements) *User:62.171.198.4 (same) *Talk:Divine Path (yet another violation of Project:Only revert once with regard to the spoiler tag) *User talk:Thervold/N/any Pure Blood (strangely discourteous comment in a user talk page) *Talk:GWFreaks (though she was just one of many poor behavers there) And so on. This user clearly feels that she is an admin of this site, contrary to fact. Though anon phrased in rather poorly, Stabber has shown a pattern of "street thuggery" here. Am I making too big a deal of this? Possibly, but as I said, I think this issue neds to be forced. F G 05:28, 7 May 2006 (CDT) :Sorry F G, but I burst to a huge laugh after reading those. I didn't see a single thing which would bother me besides possibly the GWFreaks talk, where she wasn't the only one making suspicious comments. I didn't see the revert war in Shiros page, so if you could point me to the right dates there, please do so. You really want Stabber banned, don't you? --[[User:Gem|'Gem']] 05:39, 7 May 2006 (CDT) ::Sorry, the revert was was in Shiro Tagachi itself. As to whether I want her banned or not, in all honesty, I don't support the ban myself. I am trying to force a policy discussion about revert wars and things of that nature. Who should be empowered to enforce policies. This ban notice is the best way to get everyone's attention, not the least of whom is Stabber herself, who should speak up if she is reading. F G 05:42, 7 May 2006 (CDT) :::Right, well, since that means that officially nobody supports the ban, I'm removing the notice. I don't mind a good policy discussion, but if that's what you want, Stabbers user page is not the place. --Bishop (rap| ) 05:51, 7 May 2006 (CDT) You are totally off track here, FG. First of all, yes, Stabber has a short temper. She will admit to that hercelf. I should know: I shared a cubicle with her for three years. Secondly, she has been nominated for adminship here at least once, and she has refused every time because she is well aware of her temper and tries (and sometimes fails) to keep it in check. Thirdly, it appears from the bonding build page that this anon user was simply wrong. You yourself were instrumental in proving it! I think content should come before policy always. About what should be done about reversals, you might just find that there aren't enough regulars here to really make a big deal of it. In my short time here I've seen one or two spats, but they have always ended amiably without the need for the police to step in. I think you are showing very poor judgment in asking for this ban just to raise an issue. You might want to read Wikipedia:Don't disrupt Wikipedia to illustrate a point, which I think is a model of policy clearheadedness (as much of Wikipedia's policies are). Now I'm an even lighter user of GuildWiki than you---I was only made aware of it on Stabber's recommendation, and I am more of a reader than a writer---so you might have more perspective. But I think you are off track. esan 06:11, 7 May 2006 (CDT) :All right, I'll drop the issue. You're probably right that this was bad judgement on my part. Sorry everyone. F G 06:19, 7 May 2006 (CDT) :For reference, she was nominate here, and she refused the nomination here. I am actually deeply sorry now for my comments above and wish I could simply erase them. Please accept my humble apologies, Stabber. F G 06:54, 7 May 2006 (CDT) While the issue has been dropped, I just want to say I didn't come to stabber's defense because I didn't even see the ban notice. Even if she does get banned, how long would it have been? All the issues she were involved in have ceased to be a problem, so banning her wouldn't do any good anyways. -PanSola 15:12, 7 May 2006 (CDT) :Well, the banning notice was only a device and a very crude one. What I really wanted to spark was a discussion on what limits normal users are subject to with respect to enforcing GuildWiki policies. I notice, for instance, that normal users often post ban notices on the first offense and that these ban notices are nearly always honoured. One presumes that the sysops are doing the due dilligence, because if not, this is just altogether bad. With regard to more holistic policies such as Project:Only revert once and Project:You are valuable, I personally hold that normal users have no business policing them, and, moreover, that if they do police them that they should be warned. Anything else just smells like vigilanteism or "street thuggery". I'm not fully familiar with the sysop selection process here, but one hopes that they have been selected precisely because they can calmly examine the facts of a dispute and give their impartial judgement. Normal users are not subject to this high standard, and most definitely would not live up to it even if they were. F G 16:39, 7 May 2006 (CDT) :By the by, if this discussion should be moved out of this talk page, please let me know where I should move it to. F G 16:52, 7 May 2006 (CDT) ::I think non-admins do have bussiness policing Project:Only revert once and Project:You are valuable. They police the former by not reverting someone's re-reverts, and also by encouraging discussion on the issue on the talk page. They police the latter by encouraging other users (esp anons) to help pitch in and contribute. I don't see anything wrong with that. I know I always check user history before banning, and while I can't speak for others, I have confidence that the other admins also do the same. -PanSola 17:35, 7 May 2006 (CDT) :::I don't understand your comment. One does not police a rule by following it. One polices it by making sure others follow it, and punish those who don't. Normal users do not have the authority to punish anyone, and they should not pretend that they do. F G 17:48, 7 May 2006 (CDT) ::::Nor are they capable of punishing others, and I have yet noticed ppl pretending they are capable of punishing others. All they do is report cases of policy violations, so others with power can investigate and react. I still don't see anything wrong with it. -PanSola 17:53, 7 May 2006 (CDT) :::::Ah, but what was this revert war but an attempt to enforce a policy? I think Project:Only revert once should be clarified to state that if you see a violation of this policy, don't jump in and try to correct it. Rather, report it to someone who has the authority to arbitrate. It should be made very clear that normal users do not have arbitration powers. F G 18:28, 7 May 2006 (CDT) ::::::You cannot enforce a policy by breaking it. It wouldn't be right even for admins to revert it the way Stabber did. It had nothing to do with whether Stabber was a normal user or an admin. Over at Shiro Tagachi I was getting ready to ban BOTH Karlos and Stabber if they continue to ignore my pleas and go on reverting each other, I'm glad they stopped. Even though Karlos was an admin, it was still wrong for him to revert Stabber's reverts (though he later explained he was reverting a different part of the article, which I didn't realize). -PanSola 18:33, 7 May 2006 (CDT) :::::::Fair enough. I'll just restate my original point that whatever Stabber's contributions may have been, her temper (and I should modify that to include her attitude) is not an asset to this wiki. In fact, it has a net detrimental effect. It's good that she has disappeared on a self-appointed hiatus, because otherwise I might have pushed more strongly for the ban. Just the mere fact that this user "leaves GuildWiki" every other week points to a high degree of instability. People who can't handle online disputes with more grace should simply stay away. F G 18:53, 7 May 2006 (CDT) ::::::::I disagree with your last statement. We all know, Stabber knows it herself, that she isn't the best at controlling herself, but still I would NEVER like her to leave the wiki. She is very valluable to the wiki and a great person. If I would see Stabber banned or otherwise left outside the wiki community, I would not stay here with you guys. No offence, but I put her above most of you on my list of great wiki friends. --[[User:Gem|'Gem']] 01:46, 8 May 2006 (CDT) :::::::::Ditto Gem. I was reliefed to not have to temp-ban her. -PanSola 01:49, 8 May 2006 (CDT) ::::::::::Sorry for continuing after achiving this but I have one more thing to say. If someone ever again digs these things and uses them against Stabber, please also add a ban request for me because of the revert war with DragonWR12LB here. STABBER you're listening to ONE person! Please don't be so hot-headed.. Skuld 14:06, 9 May 2006 (CDT) :I must admit my faith in the guildwiki has been tested of late but nothing like what you've gone through. What F G said was the most vindictive thing I've ever read on the GuildWiki. I think Gem has said he'll leave if you do, I don't want to think about that, I want to stay to make sure you do. Maybe I'm fanning the flames by saying this, I don't care, I want you to know that I support you, there's no way I'd support someone who uses language like F G does. I'm so angry so I can't imagine how you're feeling, if it was me I think I'd be so cut up I'd be pissing shards of glass at this point. Good luck with Tanaric's arbitration, I support you and I'm sure many others here do to. I'm sorry that you've been dragged through this. --Xasxas256 18:20, 9 May 2006 (CDT) ::If you didn't allready, you can read it all at User talk:F G#Request for proof. I'm just waiting for the next move of F G and letting the matter settle for now. --[[User:Gem|'Gem']] 18:24, 9 May 2006 (CDT) :::For those of you who care: Project:Requests for arbitration. —Tanaric 21:31, 9 May 2006 (CDT) :Tantrums or no, you're my favorite wikignome, Stabber. Skuld is only ONE person too, but you should listen to him, 'cause he invited me to his guild (even if my wife may force me to leave it again). ;) --Bishop (rap| ) 18:50, 9 May 2006 (CDT) ::Well I'm not sure if you're still reading this (perhaps esan is) but I've made my opinion clear here Project_talk:Requests_for_arbitration/Stabber_and_esan_vs_F_G. I don't blame you for a second for leaving but it's a shame to see you go. I don't even see what I can do to try to avoid this kind of thing happening in the future. Orwell's 1984 opened my eyes, this is opening my eyes too, people can be cruel. Nothing good has come out of this, no hope that it won't happen in the future has been given from our overbearers but I'd love to see you come back and fight the good fight again. --Xasxas256 09:22, 10 May 2006 (CDT) :::Oh, I'm reading, but you know, being a nonentity and possibly a sockpuppet, and blinded by loyalty, it doesn't really matter. Now that the dust has settled, I've realised that I just completely disagree with Tanaric's assessment of Stabber's contributions. He (and many others) have simply accepted FG's assessment of her, that she only does minor "maintenance worker" stuff. Keeps the curtains taut, carpets scrubbed, ashtrays emptied, that sort of thing. They keep saying that FG's comments were harsh but accurate, when I would say they were unjustified and wrong. But, what would I, a nonentity and possibly a sockpuppet, completely blinded to reason by loyalty, know? So I see the thing with the skillboxes bothered her enough that she came back and finished that task. Big deal! Anyone else could have done it. Now let us see about that new Droknar's running guide. That, unlike fiddling with skillboxes, seems useful and valuable and scholarly. esan 12:30, 10 May 2006 (CDT) ::::Whoa! Don't take words of one or two people so seriously. Most of us said clearly taht her edits are not crap or only maintenance working. I clearly stated that I appreciate her work a lot, don't say I didn't. --[[User:Gem|'Gem']] 12:38, 10 May 2006 (CDT) ::::Btw: PanSola was crying for the skill boxes and we are all really happy that Stabber came for a short visit to do them. The Droks running guide was almost tagged for deletion. --[[User:Gem|'Gem']] 12:40, 10 May 2006 (CDT) :Heh. I blame you, Stabber, for leaving. Come back, don't let someone who does not like you dictate what you will or will not do and don't make it a habbit to leave whenever something bothers you here. It diminshes your credibility and your dedication when every month you quit the wiki because of an incident with another user. You're more valuable than this and you're better than this. Hope to see you back soon. --Karlos 11:18, 10 May 2006 (CDT) ::I agree. You jumped on the first build I submitted, and I hated and loved you for it. Despite the controversey over at GWGuru, I still appreciated how you cleaned it up and left some comments about the build and the nature of my activies on GuildWiki. I don't know you at all, but I wish more people like you were around on this wiki.--Jack Valmont 17:38, 12 May 2006 (CDT) ::Uhm...not sure how to go about this, but ah...well, I saw the work you did with Melandru's Toucher (based off of the Touch Ranger) build, and I have a similar issue I wanted help with, so I clicked over here to politely request your assistance...and found this quasi-political hotbed. I've seen your work, and the work of your bot almost everywhere and you seemed like the most competent person to approach. I know you're gone, or intend to be or whatnot, but if the word of a mildly-adoring fan matters, I'd appreciate your continued participation. My own opinion is that F G did a very hit-and-run insult attack, like many people on the internet, and was just looking to cause a fracas - if they stood behind what they said, they would not have made a 'final edit' after the desired stink was raised. Anyhow, if you're still around, I'd like to humbly ask you to peruse http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Category_talk:Builds and read over my request for help there. GodOfAtheism 22:54, 16 May 2006 (CDT)